The Curious Case of David Thompson and Victor Zammit

I have yet to see any published evidence of survival emanating from Thompson,Caylor or the Andersons, similar to the examples I have posted on here and other forums from genuine physical mediums like Alec Harris, Leslie Flint, Estelle Roberts etc.

I doubt we ever will.

Z

Good comment but sad Z. Of course it is the hope that they just may do it that drives people to them. It also precludes their ability to question especially as they are aware that only those who show their support and truly believe may enter the doorway of the seance. Those who may ask difficult questions or suggest the undertaking of serious research may not (at least this part is clear for DT and WC).

I really have no information on the Andersons for or against except I realise they have not produced proof of the order of those you mention.

Jim

Admin wrote:Good comment but sad Z. Of course it is the hope that they just may do it that drives people to them. It also precludes their ability to question especially as they are aware that only those who show their support and truly believe may enter the doorway of the seance. Those who may ask difficult questions or suggest the undertaking of serious research may not (at least this part is clear for DT and WC).

I really have no information on the Andersons for or against except I realise they have not produced proof of the order of those you mention.

Jim

Hi Jim

The Andersons don't like anyone questioning their 'mediumship' either and won't allow them into their 'seances'.

What a contrast to genuine mediums who had nothing to hide and welcomed questions.

Z

Hi Jim

I posted on the COSC Group and was promptly banned

Comment by cheryl

Hi Nina

Those questions are from people who have a great deal of knowledge about Physical Mediumship, and yes they do believe in Physical Mediumship. Some of them have had absolutely amazing experiences of the 'yesteryear' seances.

Hi Rosheen

They are simply questions regarding Davids mediumship. They are not negative, and there is absolutely no cry of fraud about them. The reluctance to answer the questions is more worrying.

Why are people who ask questions regarded as negative ? Should we not be able to question ? Everyone is accountable for their actions even mediums.


No cause for a ban really, but they will not tolerate anything but nicey nicey to the mediums.

The full account can be seen > http://spiritualistchatroom.forumotion.com/physical-mediumship-f2/physical-mediumship-4u-t796.htm

Hi Cheryl,

Thanks for that. They still have strong support from Foy, Zerdin and others so they really could not care less.

Indeed Robin Foy's forum helps bring them new credence because it is well subscribed, has amongst its numbers many with a high reputation in Physical mediumship, like Tom Harrison a living Icon and tolerates no criticism of VZ and COSC. It is also clear that, despite the issue of his never being investigated by the SPR although DT claimed he had been, Guy Lyon Playfair, an SPR Committee Member, is supportive. Sadly it seems to be as a result of a mention of an SPR case, at a DT seance, which he felt only Montague Keen (MK) would know he had worked upon, so it had to be MK communicating. Your points are quite correct, their was never a reason for the ban but sadly we must, after 18 months, probably be forced to assume that they cannot answer our queries or to do so would mean an admission that they may have problems so they want rid of us wherever possible. In that case their approach combined with the support is quite effective for now. There are a mass of people who will ignore problems for the chance to pay what must now be heading up to the 150 aus dollar or even in stirling terms 100 pound per person for the seance experience with DT.

I always wonder why so many copied much from Stewart Alexander but never the luminous patches on their clothes and the luminous cable ties.

Jim

Jim wrote:

I always wonder why so many copied much from Stewart Alexander but never the luminous patches on their clothes and the luminous cable ties.

In the interests of accuracy when I first sat with Stuart he was roped into his chair.

It was Colin Fry and the NAS who introduced cable ties to the seance room

Much later Stuart adopted them and later still stuck luminous patches on his knees.

I am not aware of luminous cable ties.

Z

I hear that after the posting of the questions on Robin Foy's new forum there may have been some reaction from people who read them. Indeed, although the post has been removed, I understand that DT is writing justifications of his position which may contain factual errors and be entirely misleading. With luck I will be able to post those on here soon to keep this thread updated.

I did notice one lovely piece that came out of VZ's latest report on Photoplasm. On the site describing this interesting phenomena http://ghostcircle.com/_photoplasm.html there is the following comment

"As quoted by David Thompsons guide “William” when he was asked about “photoplasm” by Victor Zammit on the 28th January 2007, some old techniques work best and “newfangled ways that they try and introduce do not always have sustainability of communication, as was seen during The Scole Experiments.”"

Not sure Robin Foy would like the disparaging remarks about Scole but still. What I find more amusing is that their were distinct people in Spirit who wanted DT to move to work with energy not ectoplasm.

"Not sure Robin Foy would like the disparaging remarks about Scole but still. What I find more amusing is that their were distinct people in Spirit who wanted DT to move to work with energy not ectoplasm."


I asked in another thread what is meant by 'working with energy'. (yes I'm well aware of the claims once made by the NSSF! )

I'd still like an explanation if anyone can help me?

Hmm Mac what a question maybe we should start a thread and see if anyone can give an answer. Indeed I'm not sure any one person could give an answer that all would agree too. The Scole Experiments were trying to use a form of energy but it seems to me, by the way the whole thing eneded that this was inherently unstable. Clearly there was proven phenomena in the eyes of the independent researchers but I can't really see the point of a lot of what was done nor that the verified material backed up some of the more extreme items to create a believable whole.

I also believe that the various energy mediums are each working more or less in independent areas. Yes lets open up a thread and see what people contribute.

Jim

I have received a copy of DT’s words and they are shown below. My comments interposed in another colour I apologise for the spelling errors in this work but it is as DT wrote.
Hi Everyone,

Thought I would like to add my thoughts upon the subject.

In the past a certain few individual have stated publicly the I expressed I was not a materialisation medium, which of course untrue.
Hmm DT entered a debate with Z on the old SCR in which he agreed that if the true definition of a Materialisation Medium was full materialization of a person, recognized by a séance attendee, speaking with a similar style to that person, the same phraseology, showing memories of events and in sufficient light to be seen by all then he DT was not a Materialisation Medium. Copies of that SCR discussion are widely available although the site was lost.
My thoughts are it matters not to me and I think to anyone else what type of materialisation is taking place, the truth is as our seances are held in the dark ,only spirit for sure can know what is taking place, and how anyone else can have an informed opinion I cant understand. ( For interest he may say that but in a later post he continues to try to justify himself saying “Materialisation really is, to quote an expalnation from an encyclopedia:A CREATION OR AN APPEARANCE OF MATTER FROM UNKOWN SOURCES. No where have I found that it has to be full form, the word matter to me indicates it could be a small amount as tiny as a grain of sand or as large as a mountain.
Personally I feel the distinction between what is and what is not materialisation is unimportant, the fact that there is communication is a wondeful thing.When people become two focused upon aspects that in the great scheme of things do no matter, they miss the true meaning of what they should be doing, and that is giving of themselves 100% to do spirits work).”

For a man for whom it does not matter (as he says “it matters not to me”) he protests too much. In addition he notes “the truth is as our seances are held in the dark ,only spirit for sure can know what is taking place, and how anyone else can have an informed opinion I cant understand.” I agree with him, sadly it is also indicating that no one attending the séances can be sure of what is happening. I cannot be sure how it is 100% Spirits work if in the dark only spirit can be sure what is taking place and all that attendees think is just conjecture, through the lack of evidential vision. This cannot be Materialisation which as DT’s encyclopedia says is “A CREATION OR AN APPEARANCE OF MATTER”. In the darkness no one can see if there is a creation and without light there can be no appearance q.e.d. no DT can not be a Materialisation because nothing is seen, not even a “grain of sand”.

As a medium who is always developing my ability of Physical Mediumship, I work only under the guidance of the circle guides and dont listen to the uniformed persons who often have an opinion without really knowing themselves what is happening.

My task as a developing medium is to try and prove that life continues after death, not to pander to the people who are quick to criticise and often have no ability of Physical Mediumship themselves.

Well one of the leading uninformed people was his long term Haymist Circle leader, together with many others with a huge amount of experience in Mediumship of all kinds. In terms of his “developing’ one of my greatest concerns is in the three years since COSC was formed we see no real development especially in the last 15 months. The film was taken a very long time ago now and suppressed for quite some time. It appears maybe he should listen to some of the expertise available. This is especially so given the fact it is clear that either his main circle guide misled DT about their real nature, not being who they say they are, or DT misheard them in some way and is thereby not getting good spirit advice. Clearly issues like Aspirin and Cancer are indicative that this might not be his wisest source of information.

People will always have their opinion on my mediumship because I do demonstrate in public, well that is one of the aspects of working in the public eye, I understand that and except it.
The one thing I learnt from spirit in the early years of my development, is never listen to the living worlds thoughts on my mediumship but only listen to the spirit world, this advise has served me well over the years and advise I will always follow.

I have already commented on the problem with his links in the Spirit World. Sadly his Haymist Circle leader said none of the problems would have survived with that circle because of the skill and experience of its members. It may be that DT is not surrounded by individuals with that level of experience and skill to offset the problems with his main control guide the non existent William Charles Cadwell

I will not answer questions from people who have their own agenda, and one that is of an unspiritual nature.

By the way DT it is not unspiritual to ask questions.


I could enter into this debate, but I feel it is a debate that all persons will have an opinion upon, but will not be able to prove either way,

DT we do have proof not opinions and await a debate. The fact you won’t join one is an oxymoron, we have been waiting two years for one in the face of a torrent of abuse from VZ and yourself

There are many people on this site (nb he is talking of Foy’s forum), who have years of experience of Physical Mediumship, many at the sharp end shall we say like Robin Foy, it is these people who in my mind are worth listening to, not the people who want to force their thoughts and opinions on other.

There are many who have been involved in this issue who are asking the questions with a phenomenal amount of experience that you could use as a resource DT if you entered into a debate about these significant issues

What has made me the medium that I am? having the approach that I have, one that does not mean to offend but to do spirits work.

Hmm it appears you do William Charles Cadwells work and no one has any idea who or what he truly is except he has lied about his existence.
Best Regards to all


Many clearly want to see his séances and all now know that this is only possible if you believe unswervingly in him and do not raise questions which DT and his team do not want to face

"Many clearly want to see his séances and all now know that this is only possible if you believe unswervingly in him....."

Sadly it still appears to be the excitement surrounding the production of phenomena which is the magnet for many sitters - not an interest in demonstrating survival evidence.

Many years back I got into hot water for daring to suggest that this situation obtained in many of the physical mediumship demonstrations. I don't see any significant change from what I saw then. Plus ça change, c'est plus la même chose...

Perhaps we only have ourselves to blame because we encourage this interest by fruitlessly engaging with the practitioners?

And we compound the problem by persisting in discussing physical phenomena as if they have significance in themselves, even though we know they have not.....

...Quite!

Absolutely Mac see PN today 18/3 and Lis's article on Jonathon Koons 1853 Seances you will see just how much the same, beyond when even we saw, except in a possible past life.

Hi All,

I have heard on the grapevine that DT is seeking an overseas trip to Continental Europe. Now the information I have heard, believe it or not because I have no factual material about it to post, is it will be to 3 countries excluding the UK but probably including Spain. The same information states that the charges will be 200 euros (currently about aus $ 400) per person with a guaranteed minimum paid attendance of 25 (so DT/COSC gets a minimum 5000 euros a seance or around $10,000 aus plus an extra 200 euros for every extra attendee). The plan is a guarantee of 4 seances per country (ie the organiser has to guarantee 20,000 euros in payment from each country or $40,000 aus). So COSC/DT earn aus $ 120,000 on the trip. (Hmm does that mean his charge of $100 aus per seance here guaranteed minimum $2,500 aus will be increasing, seems likely).

These details are much in line with his USA plans which fell apart when people over there objected to some of the terms, like the form for each participant and also became aware of the unanswered questions listed in this thread( which were then on teh old SCR which was hacked several times before its death after the USA fiasco) as an offset to the claims of DT's abilities. At that time the seance organisers were expected to provide return air fares for 5 and accomodation, these terms are standard for DT/COSC so I am sure they also apply here.

A very lucrative venture and I suspect there will be many willing to pay out even though they should be aware of all these issues. However, should they voice them they must know they will not be welcome so most will stay silent and go along for the ride. Indeed the organisers need to be aware that COSC will vet the attendee list and reject anyone they wish.

Can they do this, well DT I am sure remains a UK citizen so he is free to work anywhere in the EEC, however, they have said in the past that all payments are now to COSC for tax reasons. COSC however is an Australian organisation and given the large commercial sums involved I am sure there may be some restrictions on its ability to just come to the EEC and work. No longer are we talking pocket money for the medium but amounts at the top end of the earning scale.

I would guess he excluded the UK because I doubt Zerdin P thought they could up a charge from 30 pounds in 2007 to 225 pounds (at least) to cover the costs. Equally I believe DT must be aware that by coming to the UK to work he would have a target painted in red on him from day one. One slip would be likely to have the new law let loose on him.

That brings us to another point, the new law is active throughout the EEC and the territories are now harmonised in terms of policing it so he could be tracked in all three countries. Will he now say that this is for "entertainment" if he does so I would think that the professional magicians may not wish to see an Australian travelling Company "COSC working" professionally in the EEC and I am sure they would have to seek the necessary permits themselves before travelling from aus to safeguard the organisors from a challenge from the professionals on arrival.


I await to see and hear more with interest.

Jim

Oh I forgot the much vaunted Sydney Progressive Spiritualist Centre, started by COSC is currently closed because of
"Unforseen Commitments" - an unfortunate choice of words for a medium.